British Expat Forum

I was born in the USA, however, my ancestors come from England and Ireland. I have always felt pulled to move to England and now my wife and I are contemplating it. My question is ... since I have never lived there am I considered a British ex-pat?

Also, if anyone has any information that would help us with cost of living info, average annual income info, etc., please send to me at ... pastor.bruceball@yahoo.com.

If you have any information about Protestant churches (names, areas) in southern England, let me know of that, too. I thank you so much.

Hi and welcome to the forum. I just can't imagine why you would want to move from a place like Coolidge, or the San Tan Valley back to the UK. The climate change for one thing would be incredible going from hot and dry to cool and wet. The UK is in as bad a state as AZ and money is tight. I assume if you are a Pastor you make a living through the church, I have absolutely no idea what you would make in the US as opposed to the UK, but be aware the cost of living in the UK is quite a bit higher than in AZ.
Southern UK is full of protestant churches ranging from the local parish churches in the smaller villages right up to Canterbury Cathedral; you might want to refine that question a little (or a lot really).
You would have to apply for immigration as since you never lived there and were not born there you most likely don't hold naturalised status. You don't say if either parent was born in the UK as that might be a way in, if not, join the queue.
Best of luck but think this through a little more, it's a huge move!
I hope to be in the San Tan valley in 3 or 4 weeks time visiting relatives, can't imagine why anyone would want to leave that Casa Grande area.
Graeme

Hello, Graeme. Yes, I am a pastor, but I would be coming over there (perferrably to Ireland, though) to start a church and that would mean we must already have $$ to upkeep us as the church wouldn't be able to support us for a couple of years. And that is why we would go - - IF we go at all.

Regarding the weather .... we like the cold also, so that wouldn't bother us. But you are right .... the Arizona warmth is great!!! Are you moving here or just coming for a visit?

I have loads of family living around the valley and in Tucson so I'm coming to visit. I'd move there to live but my wife can't handle the heat.
Ireland would be an interesting place to try to start a Protestant church, unless you mean Northern Ireland? Eire is predominately Catholic and they don't seem to welcome other religions with open arms. Both parts of Ireland are wet and cool, such a change from AZ, you'd need to get checked for mould on a yearly basis
Good luck.
Graeme

As Graeme says:

Thanks to the Gulf Stream, Britain and Ireland have a mild climate - warm summers rather than hot ones (anything over the mid-eighties Fahrenheit is exceptional), and cool winters rather than cold ones (it doesn't usually get more than a couple of degrees below freezing). But above all, the climate is damp - west-facing parts of the islands more so than eastern areas. A look at rainfall and temperature graphs will give you a better idea.

If your strong preference is for a continental-type climate - dry weather with pronounced differences between summer and winter temperatures - rather than a maritime one, you may find the soggy north-eastern Atlantic a shock to the system. This is no small part of the reason why so many Britons have emigrated over the years.

Regarding immigration, Graeme's right again - unless your ancestors were recent, they won't count for anything. Ireland accepts grandchildren as citizens; Britain only accepts children, and even then only in restricted circumstances.

The chances of our actually migrating is so slim as to be near zero, yet there is the "possibility". If we did, it would be solely to start a church once we got there and then I would pastor it - but as I said, in reality, the chances of our actually doing that is quite nil. I almost feel as if Graeme and I should talk about "swapping" homes, but that would never work until we actually went there and found that we loved it and then only if he could talk his wife into moving here. Dave, thank you for your feedback. I do not know if it is still on TV over there, but if you ever watch 'VICAR OF DIBLY', please enjoy it for us! Thanks to public TV, we are avid fans of THE END OF THE SUMMER WINE, ONCE UPON A TIME, KEEPING UP APPEARANCES, and the very old one, ARE YOU BEING SERVED.

Why do you think there might be any demand in the UK or Ireland for a new church? Have you done any market research on this at all?

Many church buildings are being sold for warehouses, cafes, etc because of declining church-going populations. The exception might be in Eire, where there is still a strong tradition of catholicism and I doubt whether a new protestant church would be made welcome.

Have you done any research into this at all?

No, you're not a British expat just because you had British ancestors - so did most people who now inhabit the former British colonies, such as Australia, USA, etc. Things have changed.

Good luck, but your plan is so off-the-wall and appears to lack any research that it's difficult to take the idea seriously.

In any case, what would the purpose of your church be? Are you planning to be missionaries to try to persuade people to believe the same doctrines as you believe? Why would you want to do that?

Do you think we're some kind of primitive tribe who can be bought for trinkets and beads? You've stated that you've never even been to our country so why do you think you can go there and 'educate' our people about what to do? Worse still, tell them what they should believe.

Kay, I appreciate your reply, but it would seem that you are rather hostile towards churches. That being said, you are probably not used to going to, or hearing about churches. That is the reason for church plants.

Yes, I have done much research into this. I am a church planter by history, and there is no way I can begin to explain to you what a calling from God is, but you will either make your mind up as to whether you will totally discount that because you don't understand it, or you will accept it as one of those things that happen that you just aren't aware of.

At any rate, it is not "off the wall" as you put it, but rather having a desire that one is "beginning" to reach out to others and make inquiries. I would hope I am wrong in my assessment of you, but that is how your post read. I wish you well, Kay. Oh, by the way, the newer church plants in Ireland that are not Catholic are doing very well, actually.

I stand corrected, that you have done some research. I also apologise if I came over as being hostile. It wasn't my intention. However, you are probably right that I don't understand (and probably never will).

I really don't understand why you'd go to a country where you've never been, on an evangelical mission to proselytise and try to make them believe in the same things that you do.

It just seems kinda patronising to decide to go somewhere and convert people to your views. What makes your God better than anyone else's? Is it because you believe in him?

Whatever, we don't need to have a religious argument or debate. We'll help with info for you if we can. If for example you have Irish grandparents (as Dave said) and can jump through a lot of hoops to get Irish citizenship, then living and working in Ireland will be easier for you (from a bureaucratic point of view).

Can't say I've ever heard of a "church plant", although I can guess its meaning from the context.

The quote of the day from many people is that Christians try to force what they believe down other people's throats. That is very far from the truth.

If you see a really good movie, you have a desire in your heart to share it with others. If you see somebody standing in a busy road, you have a desire in your heart to try to get them to safety. You aren't shoving anything down their throats, you are trying your best to help in the best way you can.

That is all Christians try to do. Sure, some overdo and cause negatives, but most don't, yet far too many people are uncomfortable listening to them so they blame them. That is very sad, Kay. I am sorry you feel that way. Believe me, I would share with you if I had the chance, but I would never condemn you because that is not my desire.

I believe in God and I have a very close relationship with Him. He has put things in my heart before and I always try to act on them - and to be totally respectful to others as I do. If He has put it in my heart to go to someplace I have never been, to do what I can to introduce Him to others, I will. That should not make you or anyone else uncomfortable or negative - as long as it is done with respecting you as I do.

Yes, I would hope you feel towards God as I do, but all I can do is tell you who He is to me and pray that He becomes that way to you. But if you refuse that, then I don't hound you, as that would be a rather stupid way for anyone to act. I would still respect you.

I've just done a quick bit of research on the Church Planting Movement, and it doesn't give me much hope for your project. I also realise that asking religious people to be rational is unlikely to influence them, but at least let me help you understand what you're trying to do.

1. The evangelists I have met have all been itinerant, with a safe base to which they return. CPM sets out to seed self-supporting and self-replicating communities, which seems to me to run a very high risk of failure unless the planter chooses his new territory wisely. There is absolutely no way that a new church in either Ireland or England could support a pastor within two years of starting up. I believe it would be lucky to be able to pay for whatever it uses as its building for congregations.

2. My feeling is that both England and Northern Ireland would be high-risk countries. The Northern Ireland population associates evangelism with Ian Paisley, who was a militant politician using religion as a means to an end. England has a very small churchgoing population, and church congregations tend to be diminishing. Unlike most places in the US, churches are not one of the major social centres in each village or small town.

Have you ever travelled outside the US? My advice to you is the same as I'd give to anyone planning to move, even if only for two or three years. Take an exploratory trip for several months (or, better still, at least a year) first.

I moved from Washington state to Canada with the help of [Spammy link removed] They made my move much less stressful and helped me out through every step of the way.

What a twit. They think that someone pretending to be in Canada is going to fool us?

It's just another link building idiot. Perhaps I'll write to the relocation company they're representing and tell them about this. Mostly we just delete spam but sometimes we leave it for others to see that these boards are very rigorously moderated.