New Zealand - British Expat Forum

We came from the Bay Area as skilled migrants last year, lured to Christchurch with the extra points and the promsie of something called the "Canterbury IT Hub". It's been a miserable, year. I'm of Japanese descent, and I have never lived anywhere where people were so damn hostile to me. I've been called chink, chop-suey, you name it, and glared at, talked about and generally treated like something foul. I say this as a person who's lived in 7 other countries and visiting close to 40. I have also never been so consistently cold in my life, felt so ripped off by everybody from our landlord (and I identify as a New Yorker!) to the bank.

NZ is very aggressive about attracting migrants (the 900,000 foreign-born residents/citizens contribute more money to the economy just in taxes than the 310,000 NZ-born), but the fact is, a significant minority of migrants would never have come here if they were given more facts and less hype. I've met so many migrants from the U.S., U.K, continental Europe and especially Asia that are or want to leave. (I even started a support and info forum site for us.)

Seriously, give it a good, hard, pessimistic thought. It can't hurt you to know the worst-case scenario. There's good, hard, pessimistic reasons 20,000 Kiwi leave the country every year. There's some pretty hard, damn heartbreaking reasons 1 in 5 migrants leave after 5 years, with figures higher for Asians.

Hi Expat

Thanks for your very interesting, if somewhat alarming, post. Welcome to BE, by the way.

We've had postings before from people saying that the Kiwis aren't easy to make friends with. But you're our first (as far as I know) with any Japanese ancestry.

Where do you think you might try next? Some countries welcome cultural diversity - as you've said - others don't. It must be really hard to be on the receiving end of discrimination in this way. So unfair!

Xenophobia is very prevalent among some races, though. I guess it's just ignorance, as well as bigotry. I've been places where we whiteys are easily accepted but a black person, just by the colour of their skin, is not. It doesn't matter if the whitey is an ignorant slob and the black person is a kind and intelligent person. The whitey ranks higher.

I'd not realised that Japanese people (or those with Japanese ancestry) were also treated like this. The Chinese people have certainly been treated in this way in many places. Signs saying, "No dogs or Chinese". Was that in Canada?

I'd like to get to know you better as you seem like a very interesting person who would fit well into our community here. Please come over to our Chinwags board, and introduce yourself. Make some new friends.

http://www.britishexpat.com/expatforum/general/viewforum.php?f=11

I think most Canadians—certainly those of any education—would be outraged by that sign, but after a year here, I'm not at all sure if most Kiwi would be.

Taking myself over to the Chinwag section now...

Agness
"ExpatExposed"

My husband reminds me it was the "Canterbury Software Cluster", which sounded even better...

Christchurch has an unfortunate reputation regarding racism, but New Zealand is better than many countries, which is why we came here. I too have lived and worked in several countries, so have some knowledge of "redneckitis". Unfortunately, racism is two-edged, and that is something for the unwary to remember.: Arrogance and rudeness from somebody clearly racially different causes resentment and suspicion for others, and that is something which cannot be easily dealt with. example, I got my then 3 year-old grandaughter to offer oranges to kids in the local playground, and the only people to rebuff her offer was an Israeli family. She was hurt, but I explained that they had a problem, and so off she went to play with other kids including a couple of Japanese. So if I feel less than warm to people talking Hebrew from now on, whose fault is that? The rudeness comes from ignorant people who don't know you, whichever country you may live in, but your own attitude can overcome that with people who do get to know you. I always found English and German people unfriendly, until the ice is broken. Turks more open. There is no easy answer - but many people do stay and enjoy their lives from many countries, so it's not all doom and gloom!

Dear Anton77, I'm not yet in NZ and I've had very little contact with Kiwis before, but apparently I'll be moving there due to a personal consideration. To be honest (and I hope honesty and frankness is not considered inappropriate in your country) NZ doesn't convince me yet from various reasons, but I am very open to see how things are for real, how it feels to actually live there, if there is any real opportunity for a good life. I've also lived in many countries and nowadays I live in Holland, for example. I've seen manifestations of extremism and racism everywhere, but it's very interesting how society and the institutions deal with such manifestations. You can't really compare someone from Germany which is a European, cosmopolitan country or someone from Paris or London which are one of the most cosmopolitan places on Earth, to someone who had rarely seen foreigners or had very little came in contact with outside influences. Basically you can't simply put a tag on someone just because you've had a bad experience once in your life with someone from that ethnic group. Being of Jewish origin myself, I know that sometimes the right personal attitude is worthless, it's just a front, because you're always pointed at, shown, mentioned, especially in a negative context. And if something happens they will always say: "because she is a bloody Jew!" It's a matter of mentality, education and cultural contact, not much anyone can actually do about it. Let us not be so hypocrite and politically correct all the time!
ExpatExposed, I sincerely wish you to make friends who would appreciate you for who you are and how you are.

Dierdre, I am sorry if you assume antipathy on my part towards Jews, rather than towards Israelis, since there have been other instances when I have tried, with other people, to help young Israeli visitors with car problems, and heve been treated with rudeness for our pains. One Israeli family that we met in our town was delightful, and we enjoyed chatting to them, as I do the proprietor of a local cafe who's brother lives in Haifa. NZ Jews do not have the baggage of some of those people - let's not go into my thories on why that should be. However, in any country, there are local cultural differences which must be respected. Kiwis can be reserved, and did not like British Immigrants when we came here, but arrogance can get up people's noses. In spite of some strong anti-discrimination laws here, it is impossible to stop bigots from expressing themselves, but the more mixtures of cultures that we have, the harder it will be for them to get away with their small mindedness. think of yourself as helping to put them in their place! Good luck.

Hi Anton, I understand where you're coming from and I agree with you. Respect is indeed essential in keeping a community happy. I think there are people more reserved than others and it might be slightly difficult to accommodate with so many foreigners in an already consolidated and small community. However the country seems nice at least in terms of nature and I can't wait to discover more about it at the source. Thank you for your kind words.

Deirdre, I misspelt your name, sorry. If you need info, by all means e-mail me. (It is in my details) The country isn't perfect, but we have lived here for 43 years, raised our kids, and mostly have no regrets - the wine is good, excellent choices of food, and a few of us are friendly, having learned from our own experiences! I think tourists mostly get what they want, but actually living in a country - that's when reality bites, and there are countries which I have enjoyed visiting, but would not want to live in.

Anton77

As a New Zealander I am always really disappointed to hear about racism in New Zealand. It is terrible and the people who do it are usually the kind of people noone wants in their country.

In saying that I know NZers who have gone to Japan, Korea and China as diplomats and English teachers and suffered the same abuse on the streets. Not that it excuses your experience, but lets not pretend that NZ is any different from any other culture.

I would be interested to know where you lived before, as I have lived in 5 countries (the others being France, the Czech Republic, the UK and Australia, and visited God knows how many, lost count) and have always seen or experienced racism (I am Pakeha by the way) in all those countries.

I have to say I also find it amusing that Jewsih people equate a negative comment on Israelis as anti-semitic. I am Irish Roman Catholic. If someone says they dont like Irish (or I guess Italians) should I take it as an attack on Catholics? I generally avoid Israelis because of bad experiences travelling overseas and especially seeing how they treat the people in the countries in which they travel (Lao being the worst example), but I have had a Czech Jewish girlfriend and I am sitting in my office now next to a British Jew who I have a good relationship with. The 2 things are unrelated.