May's offer to the EU

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May's offer to the EU

Postby gozomark » Fri 23 Jun 2017 05:50

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-40376083

"About three million EU citizens living in the UK would be allowed to stay after Brexit, Theresa May has proposed.
A new "UK settled status" would grant EU migrants who had lived in the UK for five years rights to stay and access health, education and other benefits."

"But Downing Street has not yet specified what the cut-off date will be for new residents, after which the guarantee would no longer apply. It will be no earlier than March 2017, when the UK formally began leaving the EU by issuing the Article 50 notification, and no later than March 2019 when it will actually leave."


so it sounds like the offer is


EU citizens legally resident in the UK at the undefined cut off date will be allowed to stay in the UK

EU citizens with 5 years legal residence will get extra (and only 3 of these years needs to be prior to the cutoff date)
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby gozomark » Fri 23 Jun 2017 05:52

this reinforces the vital importance of applying for your eResidence card, as by doing so you are taking up your rights to live in Malta as an EU citizen. Legally you have to apply for it anyway if here for 90 days or more in one go.
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby deepwater1 » Fri 23 Jun 2017 07:18

does this apply to the renewal of a residence card, ours expires in nov 2018
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby DavidH » Fri 23 Jun 2017 07:52

deepwater1 wrote:does this apply to the renewal of a residence card, ours expires in nov 2018



I think all our cards expire next year, ours in September. I do know that the current PM here wants us to stay and I've been told that he will do everything in his power to make sure we can. It remains to be seen, of course, what the EU will make of her offer and although they say it's a good start the detail of the offer won't be known until Monday. The Devil, as always, being in the detail.
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby gozomark » Fri 23 Jun 2017 08:29

we are all EU citizens until Brexit actually happens, so any renewal pre that date shouldn't be effected, although they could only issue 1 year rather than 5 year ones I guess - mine expires March 2018 - I was one of the first in the group to apply I think, if so I'll let you know what happens
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby DavidH » Fri 23 Jun 2017 08:33

Thanks for your thoughts Mark
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby rasputinluv » Mon 26 Jun 2017 06:48

Does any EU national have a permanent residency of Malta or planning to apply for one? Will a PR id card allows travel within EU/Schengen area without having to carry the passport?
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby gozomark » Mon 26 Jun 2017 06:52

if you mean the permanent version of the eResidence card, then yes, quite a few have them - you need to have been resident for 5 years, and spent no more than 10 months in those 5 years outside of Malta.

No its not good for travelling - its still not an ID card, but a residence card, just one with no expiry date
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby rasputinluv » Tue 27 Jun 2017 18:00

EU published its proposal for citizens' rights on 12th June, implying status quo for all EU citizens, including British, as if Brexit never happened, keeping all the rights they have today. Mrs May says her generous offer is conditional on EU matching the same offer for the British!! So basically she is saying that EU should reduce their offer for the expat British, if they want her offer for the other EU citizens!! So much for taking back control!! Another U turn coming??
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby gozomark » Wed 28 Jun 2017 05:42

2 issues

1. who enforces the agreement ? If ECJ, then yes, big U turn by May
2. cut off date - given White Paper says between Article 50 day and Brexit day, while EU says should be Brexit day - can be agreed with no U turn
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby rasputinluv » Wed 28 Jun 2017 06:20

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... cial-lambs

The EU proposal seems to be a very fair offer, one that causes no disruption in citizen's lives and no unfair retroactive change of rights. More importantly, as far as I see, the EU27 holds practically all the cards in the so called negotiations.
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby gozomark » Wed 28 Jun 2017 06:38

I would love it if the UK accepted the EU proposal, but then I think the whole Brexit thing is a big mistake. However, given Brexit is happening, and that control of immigration and the stopping of EU power over the UK are 2 of the big reasons for Brexit, The EU proposal means continued power of the EU over the UK, and makes it that much harder for the UK to control immigration numbers.
If May had got her big majority, I guess these would remain killer issues, but who knows now, maybe the softer Brexit means the UK can accept the EU proposals in their entirety, although its difficult to see the UK agreeing to the EU continuing to have the final say - that could be a massive problem in parliament, even big enough to bring down the government
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby gozomark » Wed 28 Jun 2017 06:45

from the BBC

The British side insists that the ECJ will have no jurisdiction in the UK after Brexit. The EU insists that the ECJ must continue to offer legal protection for their citizens in the UK, just as it does now.
The obvious answer to this conundrum is to create a joint UK-EU arbitration panel that will ensure that the terms of an agreement are respected under international law. But this will require both sides to alter fairly entrenched positions.
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby DavidH » Wed 28 Jun 2017 07:03

I understand, and agree with, the EU's stance on having EU courts as arbiters otherwise it would only take a change in legislation to throw everyone's lives into chaos. The proposal for a joint arbitration panel makes some sense but it does still raise the question of sovereignty which will not go down well with the Brexiteers.

I also agree that Brexit should not have happened but accepting that it is going ahead, for the moment at least!, her hand has been considerably weakened and if it's proving this difficult on the first, and most important, issue then what chance has she got. I can't see this government surviving for long, there are already divisions in the cabinet over Brexit, they don't seem able to agree among themselves, which would indicate that they don't really have a plan. They are winging it and seem to be making it up as they go along.

Immigration should never have been allowed to become the overriding issue it became in the referendum. There are more immigrants to the UK from non-EU countries than from the EU. The movement of people around the globe has been going on for thousands of years, it's what makes the world go round. How do you define being British when the vast majority are descended from the Normans, the Vikings, even the Queen is German, need I go on?
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Re: May's offer to the EU

Postby gozomark » Wed 28 Jun 2017 07:17

"The proposal for a joint arbitration panel makes some sense but it does still raise the question of sovereignty which will not go down well with the Brexiteers"
Its also a fudge, as in the end one side or the other must have the deciding vote - is the ECJ or the UK in control ?

then we have the issue of if this is agreed, will it be ringfenced from the rest of the discussions - if not, then we still wont know our rights until everything is agreed
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